Victor-Victoria Problem: Difference between revisions
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|usernameurl=https://x.com/EricRWeinstein | |usernameurl=https://x.com/EricRWeinstein | ||
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|content= | |content=[[Victor-Victoria Problem|"The Pre/Trans Fallacy"]] is the new Prisoner's Dilemma: A seemingly minor point that, once pointed out, appears to bedevil nearly everything. | ||
|timestamp=4:40 PM Ā· Nov 21, 2016 | |timestamp=4:40 PM Ā· Nov 21, 2016 | ||
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<blockquote> | <blockquote> | ||
'''Eric Weinstein:''' ''Another thing that I think we worked up together but has another name, sometimes people call it the Pre-Trans Fallacy. I used to call it the Victor-Victoria | '''Eric Weinstein:''' ''Another thing that I think we worked up together but has another name, sometimes people call it the Pre-Trans Fallacy. I used to call it the [[Victor-Victoria Problem]] because of this movie Victor-Victoria, the story of a woman playing a man playing a woman. And so the problem was, is that if you saw a woman, did you see a female impersonator, or did you see a woman playing a female impersonator? Right? And so Bret's version of this is the one that I use the most because I think it's the best, which is, "'''Is a whale a fish?'''". It's a very innocuous question, and almost everyone who is educated gives you thisā | ||
'''Dave Rubin:''' ''Can I give you the simpleā? | '''Dave Rubin:''' ''Can I give you the simpleā? | ||
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'''Eric Weinstein:''' ''So this is the middlebrow answer that almost everyone gives. And the idea being that the lowest level, you know, the whalers used to say "the whale fishes," because morphologically it swims like a fish, looks like a fish, got a tail, obviously a fish. One level up from that, you say, "Oh, no, it's a mammal. It crawled back into the sea many years ago and evolved in water and breathes air and gives live birth." But the problem is, one level above that, the thing reverses back because you're bracketed on Darwin's phylogenetic tree between Lampreys, which are clearly fishesāI'm just, all I'm doing Bret is stealing your thunder hereāand Coelacanths, let's say, and so all mammals are fishes. So if somebody says that a whale is a fish, you don't know whether you're dealing with somebody who's just completely uneducated, or somebody who does this for a living. And that confusion of not knowing whether you're sophisticated relative to somebody's point or unsophisticated is one of the ways in which great conversations just derail. | '''Eric Weinstein:''' ''So this is the middlebrow answer that almost everyone gives. And the idea being that the lowest level, you know, the whalers used to say "the whale fishes," because morphologically it swims like a fish, looks like a fish, got a tail, obviously a fish. One level up from that, you say, "Oh, no, it's a mammal. It crawled back into the sea many years ago and evolved in water and breathes air and gives live birth." But the problem is, one level above that, the thing reverses back because you're bracketed on Darwin's phylogenetic tree between Lampreys, which are clearly fishesāI'm just, all I'm doing Bret is stealing your thunder hereāand Coelacanths, let's say, and so all mammals are fishes. So if somebody says that a whale is a fish, you don't know whether you're dealing with somebody who's just completely uneducated, or somebody who does this for a living. And that confusion of not knowing whether you're sophisticated relative to somebody's point or unsophisticated is one of the ways in which great conversations just derail. | ||
- [https://youtu.be/MmXq97do-tQ?t=6811 The Rubin Report] | |||
</blockquote> | </blockquote> | ||
{{#widget:YouTube|id=MmXq97do-tQ|start=6811}} | {{#widget:YouTube|id=MmXq97do-tQ|start=6811}} | ||
== Related Pages == | |||
* [[Is-a Versus Has-a]] | |||
[[Category:Culture]] | [[Category:Culture]] | ||
[[Category:Ericisms]] | [[Category:Ericisms]] | ||
[[Category:Sensemaking]] | [[Category:Sensemaking]] | ||
Latest revision as of 19:01, 3 December 2025
Named after the 1982 movie, Victor/Victoria. Also known as "Is a whale a fish?". Sometimes described as the Pre/Trans Fallacy.
"The Pre/Trans Fallacy" is the new Prisoner's Dilemma: A seemingly minor point that, once pointed out, appears to bedevil nearly everything.
Eric Weinstein: Another thing that I think we worked up together but has another name, sometimes people call it the Pre-Trans Fallacy. I used to call it the Victor-Victoria Problem because of this movie Victor-Victoria, the story of a woman playing a man playing a woman. And so the problem was, is that if you saw a woman, did you see a female impersonator, or did you see a woman playing a female impersonator? Right? And so Bret's version of this is the one that I use the most because I think it's the best, which is, "Is a whale a fish?". It's a very innocuous question, and almost everyone who is educated gives you thisā
Dave Rubin: Can I give you the simpleā?
Eric Weinstein: Yeah.
Dave Rubin: It'sāit's a mammal.
Bret Weinstein: Well, that's certainly true. But is it a fish?
Dave Rubin: But is it a fish? See, thatāI was giving you the most simple answer. Is it a fish? By what definition makes something a fish?
Eric Weinstein: So this is the middlebrow answer that almost everyone gives. And the idea being that the lowest level, you know, the whalers used to say "the whale fishes," because morphologically it swims like a fish, looks like a fish, got a tail, obviously a fish. One level up from that, you say, "Oh, no, it's a mammal. It crawled back into the sea many years ago and evolved in water and breathes air and gives live birth." But the problem is, one level above that, the thing reverses back because you're bracketed on Darwin's phylogenetic tree between Lampreys, which are clearly fishesāI'm just, all I'm doing Bret is stealing your thunder hereāand Coelacanths, let's say, and so all mammals are fishes. So if somebody says that a whale is a fish, you don't know whether you're dealing with somebody who's just completely uneducated, or somebody who does this for a living. And that confusion of not knowing whether you're sophisticated relative to somebody's point or unsophisticated is one of the ways in which great conversations just derail.